Thank you for pointing out that the risk of myocarditis from infection is higher than from vaccination. I feel like that point was missed in many stories about vaccination side effects.
Why still require 2 original formulation vaccines before the omicron boost? Why not give an omicron series followed by an omicron boost? (admittedly, there are probably not many who are not vaxed who would start now, but the rule seems to be start with the old series.) If the vaccines are only a few amino acids different, why delay for months omicron coverage for the (sadly) few new converts?
yes, thanks! I appreciate your updates. I am curious too whether you think there is a difference between Pfizer's or Moderna's. Mostly Moderna's data was reviewed by you today.
Moderna seemed to have more detailed information, with the intriguing detail about protection in the lungs as well as enhanced ability to bind not only to Omicron but other variants? Pfizer did not seem to have the same level of detail, but I had to hop off and on during Pfizer and may well have missed it.
so should we stay with the vaccine mfr that did our original shot, or do you think it matters at all? I mean for an adult who would be eligible for either one, and assuming equivalent availability (which is a big assumption of course).
"People produced antibody responses from all three booster vaccines, no matter which vaccine they had originally received. A booster of a different vaccine caused similar or higher antibody responses than a booster of the same vaccine."
Tricky isn't it. Study results are "preliminary" and the study really only deals with a first booster shot and this would be the fourth such (for most of those reading these comments) I suspect. When the first boosters came out, "unofficial" suggestions were to get a different one because it might "broaden" the coverage. Seems to be no such rumors at the moment. But I think there will be different timing of availabilty on Moderna and Pfizer, so it seems to me that getting it sooner rather than later is the way we will go - in the absence of more info.
What about Novavax as a booster? Isn’t it more durable since it focuses on the S2?
Haven’t been boosted since last November and holding out for Novavax booster since I rarely leave the house and presume BA2.75 will be the dominant in US in winter.
Any idea when Novavax as a booster could be approved?
Thank you for this summary! I was off and on the meeting this morning, and I wonder if heard anything that helps make a comparison between Moderna and Pfizer in terms of which might be the best bet? Moderna seemed to talk more about enhanced ability of their bivalent booster (including the info you share), but I didn’t hear the same detail from Pfizer (though I had to be off and on through Pfizer).
Please comment on optimum timing for the annual "Flu Shot" relative to the new booster's timing since the former is nigh and the latter might seem even "nigher".
Why does the Moderna bivalent booster only raise neutralizing antibodies by 1.22x but the equivalent on Pfizer looks like over ten fold vs the original formulation on BA1?
Did they discuss timing of the bivalent booster? 5 months after the last primary series vaccine? Any thoughts on timing of the bivalent booster after a documented infection? Thanks as always for the information!
No question the vaccines are a critical component for mitigating both acute and potentially long-term effects from this corona virus. A significant segment of the population has been identified as having Long-Covid signs and symptoms, but there are many who believe "it won't happen to me" or "I'll take chances because it's just another bad cold". We need some durable treatments. This is being addressed thru the NCATS, FDA, CDC and C-Path having recently established a website for providing personal case reports for COVID19 infections. This follows their mobile app for community physicians to anonymized report cases using repurposed, effective protocols for patients infected with SARS-Cov2 (and other infections). Repurposed drugs are safe , FDA-approved and one such drug is actively being prescribed to treat COVID19 positive people off-label. To be sure, off-label does not in any way infer that the drug is experimental. Such a drug has been used for other serious conditions and the pathologies in the previously approved condition have common pathophysiologies with progressive COVID19. Read more about repurposing here: "The CURE Drug Repurposing Collaboratory (CDRC), a public-private partnership initiated in June 2020 by C-Path and the FDA in partnership with the National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences (NCATS) part of the NIH. Info: CDRC: <https://c-path.org/cdrc> and also CURE ID website <https://cure.ncats.io> to read more about repurposing for a variety of infections. COVID19 is a pressing issue as ~30% of our population remains unprotected with no or incomplete vaccination. Whether that percentage will drastically change with the next booster offering is highly doubtful according to many sources. Ray Sullivan, MD
Dr Hart, please review the Discussion forum and the 38 cases in the CURE ID website (COVID-19) I described. (The last I noted, the curator for that website only approved/reviewed 12 but I can identify 38 on my activity list) . I have described the protocol on YLE some time ago but it did not pass the editing, therefore details are found elsewhere. I didn’t want to repeat that “dismissal”. Sullray<at>gmail…..
re the 72% of Americans getting the booster, is that 72% of the population that has previously got at least two of the vaccinations, or 72% of the total population.
Thank you so much for the detailed breakdown of this process. I always appreciate reading your thoughts -- it helps me digest all the info. As someone who has had 3 Moderna boosters, I'm not sure if I should get Pfizer or Moderna for this one -- any data on that?
What I have heard, from a doctor who does research in this area, is stick with Moderna. His comment is based on the old vaccines and boosters. Mix and match is designed to make sure everyone gets a little Moderna.
It’s interesting both the Bidens got Pfizer, if Moderna is in fact better for some reason. I wonder what Fauci and Walensky got?
Thank you for pointing out that the risk of myocarditis from infection is higher than from vaccination. I feel like that point was missed in many stories about vaccination side effects.
Why still require 2 original formulation vaccines before the omicron boost? Why not give an omicron series followed by an omicron boost? (admittedly, there are probably not many who are not vaxed who would start now, but the rule seems to be start with the old series.) If the vaccines are only a few amino acids different, why delay for months omicron coverage for the (sadly) few new converts?
Because we don't expect Omicron to always be the dominant variant of concern, AND we have seen good response from the original vaccines.
yes, thanks! I appreciate your updates. I am curious too whether you think there is a difference between Pfizer's or Moderna's. Mostly Moderna's data was reviewed by you today.
Moderna seemed to have more detailed information, with the intriguing detail about protection in the lungs as well as enhanced ability to bind not only to Omicron but other variants? Pfizer did not seem to have the same level of detail, but I had to hop off and on during Pfizer and may well have missed it.
Thanks!
I saw that info too- very intriguing and promising.
Did you see anything similar for Pfizer?
so should we stay with the vaccine mfr that did our original shot, or do you think it matters at all? I mean for an adult who would be eligible for either one, and assuming equivalent availability (which is a big assumption of course).
Came to ask the same! Any advantage to a switch (for example, fully vax’d/boosted with pfizer and then switch to Moderna)?
"People produced antibody responses from all three booster vaccines, no matter which vaccine they had originally received. A booster of a different vaccine caused similar or higher antibody responses than a booster of the same vaccine."
Tricky isn't it. Study results are "preliminary" and the study really only deals with a first booster shot and this would be the fourth such (for most of those reading these comments) I suspect. When the first boosters came out, "unofficial" suggestions were to get a different one because it might "broaden" the coverage. Seems to be no such rumors at the moment. But I think there will be different timing of availabilty on Moderna and Pfizer, so it seems to me that getting it sooner rather than later is the way we will go - in the absence of more info.
We had the identical experience and now have 3 Pfizer’s followed by one Moderna.
What about Novavax as a booster? Isn’t it more durable since it focuses on the S2?
Haven’t been boosted since last November and holding out for Novavax booster since I rarely leave the house and presume BA2.75 will be the dominant in US in winter.
Any idea when Novavax as a booster could be approved?
Thank you for this summary! I was off and on the meeting this morning, and I wonder if heard anything that helps make a comparison between Moderna and Pfizer in terms of which might be the best bet? Moderna seemed to talk more about enhanced ability of their bivalent booster (including the info you share), but I didn’t hear the same detail from Pfizer (though I had to be off and on through Pfizer).
Please comment on optimum timing for the annual "Flu Shot" relative to the new booster's timing since the former is nigh and the latter might seem even "nigher".
No restrictions on flu and concomitant COVID mRNA dosing that I'm aware of.
Why does the Moderna bivalent booster only raise neutralizing antibodies by 1.22x but the equivalent on Pfizer looks like over ten fold vs the original formulation on BA1?
It's fascinating that Offitt criticizes existing boosters for the risk of OAS (original antigenic sin) because they use the original formulation.
Then he turns around and votes against the Omicron booster.
What's his motive? Who's funding him?
clear and coherent as usual. I liked knowing it will be simpler for people starting out (firstshot, booster, biValent booster).
Did they discuss timing of the bivalent booster? 5 months after the last primary series vaccine? Any thoughts on timing of the bivalent booster after a documented infection? Thanks as always for the information!
I saw in the NYT yesterday that they recommended that people who have recently had covid wait 3-6 months before getting bivalent booster
No question the vaccines are a critical component for mitigating both acute and potentially long-term effects from this corona virus. A significant segment of the population has been identified as having Long-Covid signs and symptoms, but there are many who believe "it won't happen to me" or "I'll take chances because it's just another bad cold". We need some durable treatments. This is being addressed thru the NCATS, FDA, CDC and C-Path having recently established a website for providing personal case reports for COVID19 infections. This follows their mobile app for community physicians to anonymized report cases using repurposed, effective protocols for patients infected with SARS-Cov2 (and other infections). Repurposed drugs are safe , FDA-approved and one such drug is actively being prescribed to treat COVID19 positive people off-label. To be sure, off-label does not in any way infer that the drug is experimental. Such a drug has been used for other serious conditions and the pathologies in the previously approved condition have common pathophysiologies with progressive COVID19. Read more about repurposing here: "The CURE Drug Repurposing Collaboratory (CDRC), a public-private partnership initiated in June 2020 by C-Path and the FDA in partnership with the National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences (NCATS) part of the NIH. Info: CDRC: <https://c-path.org/cdrc> and also CURE ID website <https://cure.ncats.io> to read more about repurposing for a variety of infections. COVID19 is a pressing issue as ~30% of our population remains unprotected with no or incomplete vaccination. Whether that percentage will drastically change with the next booster offering is highly doubtful according to many sources. Ray Sullivan, MD
"...FDA-approved and one such drug is actively being prescribed to treat COVID19 positive people off-label."
And what is that "one such drug?"
Dr Hart, please review the Discussion forum and the 38 cases in the CURE ID website (COVID-19) I described. (The last I noted, the curator for that website only approved/reviewed 12 but I can identify 38 on my activity list) . I have described the protocol on YLE some time ago but it did not pass the editing, therefore details are found elsewhere. I didn’t want to repeat that “dismissal”. Sullray<at>gmail…..
Do you know anything about plans for boosters for kids? It's been almost a year since my 6yr old received his primary series.
5 years and above are eligible for a booster 5 months after original series is complete
https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2022/s0519-covid-booster-acip.html
re the 72% of Americans getting the booster, is that 72% of the population that has previously got at least two of the vaccinations, or 72% of the total population.
Thanks again for the excellent synopsis.
Excellent info again, YLE, and very clear, as usual. Thanks!
Thank you so much for the detailed breakdown of this process. I always appreciate reading your thoughts -- it helps me digest all the info. As someone who has had 3 Moderna boosters, I'm not sure if I should get Pfizer or Moderna for this one -- any data on that?
Same question~! How much should we value mixing as compared to dose amounts, other specifics?
What I have heard, from a doctor who does research in this area, is stick with Moderna. His comment is based on the old vaccines and boosters. Mix and match is designed to make sure everyone gets a little Moderna.
It’s interesting both the Bidens got Pfizer, if Moderna is in fact better for some reason. I wonder what Fauci and Walensky got?
Thanks - here's something from the NEJM that compares the two vaccines:
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2115463